| Well, let's hope so, anyway. This week we're talking about critiques at the League- how to take them, what's good, what's bad, etc. For me, writing doesn't happen in a vacuum, despite folks like Anne Rice supposedly shunning any editorial of her work these days. Being fairly new to the published side of the game, I can't imagine writing a complete book without getting some kind of feedback from other writers around me (I'm not very bright). My grandma's praise can only go so far and frankly, I'm a little suspect of her critical eye. So how to find people to give you criticism that's actually going to help your work? From my experience, some of the best criticism I have worked with has come from joining a writer's workshop where their feedback and insight were constant throughout the process of writing Dead To Me. Here's some of my insights: 1) I chose to join a non-genre workshop. Why? For me, good writing is good writing no matter what type of tale. I've read enough fantasy to know the tropes and such of the genre, and I felt I would benefit more by having a mixed critique group coming from a variety of genres. The multitude of opinions from those different angles made for a richer book out of me in the end. 2) Don't get defensive. I've watched people defend their work to the death before even really letting the critic finish or letting the criticism sink in. Yes, your book is your precious little baby, but if you want yer baby to grow up and wear big boy writer pants, listen. You don't have to act on what they're saying. Some of the criticism may be shit (consider the source and if you respect the type of writing they do) but give what they have to say due diligence. 3) Back patting sessions. The sign of a bad workshop is one where everyone simply strokes everyone else's ego. The odds of everyone being so genius that they have nothing critical to say are slim. You're not going to get anything helpful from this other than a false sense of accomplishment. Run away, terribly fast. Conversely, don't get caught up in a workshop where the criticism comes in the form of constant lambasting. You want criticism...the constructive kind. 4) Give as good as you get. Workshops are a symbiotic relationship by their nature. Don't expect everyone to give you great criticism if you're not going to return the favor. That's just rude. You might join one not knowing how to give good critique at first, but by listening and learning, it won't be long before you'll find that you do have something to contribute. 5) A lot of criticism given comes from each writer's personal process, which means it might be great advice, but not necessarily something that's going to work for your book. 6) There's little room for ego in a critique group. Don't get defensive, don't argue, keep any histrionics in check. Your fellow writers aren't personally attacking you , they're trying to help you tell a better story (at least in a good workshop environment). You might disagree with what they are saying, but take what they say home with you and sleep on in. Don't waste the workshop's time by raging against the writerly machine. I could go on, but then what would my fellow Leaguers be left with for the week? Probably just their Pikachu/Venture Brothers slash tales... |
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genius!
Okay, I have a major question for y'all to answer -- how to find this beauteous thing that is a good critique group? With a novel under contract and working on two (okay, fine, three) others, I'd love to have a good crit group.
But I operate under the principle that people always strive to reach the highest level of accomplishment displayed in a group (or at least that's how it was in my art group and in various bands I've been in). And this is not to sound snobby, because I have a lot to learn -- every day that I write or read a new novel I realize just what I don't know -- but I'd like to find a group of writers who are at least at the same or better level as me now, rather than the me even two years ago.
So any advice on that front? I was in an online group that was entirely of folks struggling to all finish their first or second novels over a series of years . . . not very helpful.
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Very sound advice all.
"Okay, I have a major question for y'all to answer -- how to find this beauteous thing that is a good critique group? "
I agree. The North American Spotted Critique Group is ever elusive. There have been sightings, none of which have been substantially confirmed....
I found my critique group by attending a writing workshop at our local university. Many of the people there were from out of town, but a couple were local. The workshop did some of the work for me, by being one that didn't take anyone, and I got to know people ahead of time and their critiquing style.
I echo Maggie's question. The last comment I had from an Uberagent on my fae novel was, to paraphrase, "good ideas but needs tightening, etc., find a crit group." Likely she was letting me down easy cuz I'm teh suck, but I've never been able to locate any sort of writerly support mechanism other than friends and family that may or may not read and then just nod and smile.
I think you're gettin' close, TM. I had an uberagent recommend the same thing to me and two months later I had my novel under contract. Fae, incidentally.
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This was great, Anton! Thank you! I just got my first writing/critque buddy so I'm excited!!
I agree as well... where do I find a critique group? My critique buddy is 4 hours away... :p
I should probably do a full post on how to find a critique group, and might still, but just to get you started. Check into the largest writer's association nearby. Those websites usually have links to writer's groups that are recruiting members. Colleges and libraries are a good resource. Ask the librarian or dean of the writing department for help. There are online groups, as well. I prefer face to face, because in addition to the critique on the writing, you usually read your work aloud which preps you for your future second job...publicity whore.
Finding the right crit group is like finding a pair of jeans that make your ass look good. Resign yourself to trying on a few hundred and shedding many tears of frustration in the process.
Great post, especially on not getting defensive. No one likes to crit a defensive author!
As for finding a crit group, I echo all the advice above. Also, RWA does a good job of pairing people up, especially in the local chapters. And RWA is full of writers who aren't just romance writers (like me, I'm YA). There are also good yahoo groups that will pair people up (I belong to a YA yahoo group where people occasionally post looking for a crit group).
For me, I didn't want to join a group I'd be tied to (and with a large group that's a lot of critting to do), so I agreed to crit partials with a few people until I found good matches.
Crit groups sort of magically form themselves with online friendships.
Me to friend: "Can you read my book and tell me if it blows?"
Friend: "Sure!"
Me: "Please be really really mean."
Friend: "Awesome!"
Srsly. I picked up critique partners from chatrooms on Forward Motion, the Absolute Write message-boards, and the OWW (which is fab for finding crit partners). I even glommed some from LJ.
You just need to be open to friends and say "Hey! I need beta-readers." :)
Hey, I need beta readers!
(is it working?)
Srsly, any league readers not contractually barred from reading something, I'm open to seeing if we can stand each other and/or work together on reviewing/editing.
I now return this hijacked thread to the owners.
Hold up, you can't have the thread thread back yet.
TM - e-mail me, seriously - maggiestiefvater AT gmail.com - have your fae call my fae, we'll do lunch.
Okay NOW you can have it back.
Publicity whore... right... Note to self: Once you get book bought, buy shorter skirts and easy to reach zippers.
Thanks, Mark!! ;P